Hair loss and metabolic issues

Discuss safe bets to mitigate the impact of hair loss: weightlifting, skin care, teeth whitening etc.
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actuallynotfromparis
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Hair loss and metabolic issues

Post by actuallynotfromparis » 8 months ago

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/a ... 360002763X

It has been my feeling for a long time that androgenetic alopecia happens to more and more people, men and women, at a much younger age. I am myself 24, and I feel like most of my male friends, and a good portions of my female friends have thinning hair.

At the same time, western societies have been consuming more and more and more sugar. We have been fighting fat like the plague, vegetarianism and veganism have resulted in many young people consuming less proteins and more sugars.

I'm gonna use that thread as a way to pin down everything I find about the link between the two.

(oh boy did i miss research - will add sources to everything over here later buy now i'm lazy and going to bed)
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Re: Hair loss and metabolic issues

Post by Xexos » 8 months ago

Masturbation and porn make hair much more shittier. I know people get oversensitive about this because they're addicts, but i've done at least 50 experiment on myself of abstaining and masturbating regularly and i've noticed everytime that whenever i masturbate my hair itches in male pattern baldness affected areas and i shed for a lot of days after. When i stop, shedding and itching stops. It's also not a coincidence that i started balding 10 years before my father started and no one else in my family is balding. Considering he didn't have porn or masturbated back then, it makes sense. You can also find thousands of experiences from other people on the internet by just searching, and almost on every forum you'll find countless threads about it. Not a coincidence in my opinion.

As for the science though, there's some background to this. After orgasm prolactin levels rise, these prolactin levels just so happen to increase DHT. Prolactin levels can remain elevated for as long as 2 weeks after orgasm. Therefore over-masturbation, i.e (2 times daily) will result in hormonal imbalance.

Also mastubation takes a lot of energy. It also releases many valuable minerals. A lot of Zinc is excreted through ejaculate. Excessive masturbation leads to overproduction of androgen hormones, causing adrenal and sex organ fatigue, and excess release of dopamine to maintain prolonged sexual arousal. Since dopamine is the precursor to the stress hormone epinephrine (adrenaline), excess dopamine results in the adrenal glands overproducing epinephrine and putting the body in a prolonged state of fight-or-flight stress. At the same time, norepinephrine is synthesized from dopamine and released from the adrenal medulla into the blood as a hormone, along with the stress hormone cortisol. Epinephrine, norepinephrine and cortisol fuel the fight-or-flight response, directly increasing heart rate, triggering the release of glucose from energy stores, and increasing blood flow to skeletal muscle. All of this has a severely taxing effect on the body.


Keep in mind though, masturbation DOESN'T cause male pattern baldness, male pattern baldness is genetics, masturbation could only trigger it earlier or accelerates it, but if you're destined to be bald, you'll be bald even if you never ejaculated once in your life.
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Re: Hair loss and metabolic issues

Post by actuallynotfromparis » 8 months ago

Xexos wrote:
8 months ago
Masturbation and porn make hair much more shittier. I know people get oversensitive about this because they're addicts, but i've done at least 50 experiment on myself of abstaining and masturbating regularly and i've noticed everytime that whenever i masturbate my hair itches in male pattern baldness affected areas and i shed for a lot of days after. When i stop, shedding and itching stops. It's also not a coincidence that i started balding 10 years before my father started and no one else in my family is balding. Considering he didn't have porn or masturbated back then, it makes sense. You can also find thousands of experiences from other people on the internet by just searching, and almost on every forum you'll find countless threads about it. Not a coincidence in my opinion.

As for the science though, there's some background to this. After orgasm prolactin levels rise, these prolactin levels just so happen to increase DHT. Prolactin levels can remain elevated for as long as 2 weeks after orgasm. Therefore over-masturbation, i.e (2 times daily) will result in hormonal imbalance.

Also mastubation takes a lot of energy. It also releases many valuable minerals. A lot of Zinc is excreted through ejaculate. Excessive masturbation leads to overproduction of androgen hormones, causing adrenal and sex organ fatigue, and excess release of dopamine to maintain prolonged sexual arousal. Since dopamine is the precursor to the stress hormone epinephrine (adrenaline), excess dopamine results in the adrenal glands overproducing epinephrine and putting the body in a prolonged state of fight-or-flight stress. At the same time, norepinephrine is synthesized from dopamine and released from the adrenal medulla into the blood as a hormone, along with the stress hormone cortisol. Epinephrine, norepinephrine and cortisol fuel the fight-or-flight response, directly increasing heart rate, triggering the release of glucose from energy stores, and increasing blood flow to skeletal muscle. All of this has a severely taxing effect on the body.


Keep in mind though, masturbation DOESN'T cause male pattern baldness, male pattern baldness is genetics, masturbation could only trigger it earlier or accelerates it, but if you're destined to be bald, you'll be bald even if you never ejaculated once in your life.

Hi Xexos,

As a regular from HairLossTalk three years ago, I am familiar with the idea of NoFap. However, as a person that has not been blessed at birth with the possession of a penis - I have been feeling largely unconcerned.
Thanks for explaining the hormonal details behind it.
Actually, it's only existentialism if it comes from the existentialism region in France. Otherwise, it's just sparkling anxiety.

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Re: Hair loss and metabolic issues

Post by Afro_Vacancy » 8 months ago

actuallynotfromparis wrote:
8 months ago
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/a ... 360002763X

It has been my feeling for a long time that androgenetic alopecia happens to more and more people, men and women, at a much younger age. I am myself 24, and I feel like most of my male friends, and a good portions of my female friends have thinning hair.

At the same time, western societies have been consuming more and more and more sugar. We have been fighting fat like the plague, vegetarianism and veganism have resulted in many young people consuming less proteins and more sugars.

I'm gonna use that thread as a way to pin down everything I find about the link between the two.

(oh boy did i miss research - will add sources to everything over here later buy now i'm lazy and going to bed)
This study, from 2000, found a correlation between poor metabolic health and faster alopecia in men in some Finnish town, aged 18-50. It's a small town in Finland so it's probably mono-ethnic, which reduces the noise.

I believe the result, but really the arrow of causality can go in any number of directions.

Bald people are likely not just bald, they likely have a different distribution of androgen receptors in various places in the body. That may be why bald men are more likely to get prostate cancer and heart disease. It may also be that bald men live sad lives, and thus they cope with food and alcohol.

But this would make more sense for women. Insulin -> PCOS -> baldness seems more obvious.
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I had a hair transplant operation with the clinic of Dr. Emrah Cinik in Istanbul, with 2750 grafts being mostly placed in the front. It was a success both for general aesthetics and general well-being, and I encourage others to do the same.

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Re: Hair loss and metabolic issues

Post by Xexos » 8 months ago

Afro_Vacancy wrote:
8 months ago
Bald people are likely not just bald, they likely have a different distribution of androgen receptors in various places in the body. That may be why bald men are more likely to get prostate cancer and heart disease. It may also be that bald men live sad lives, and thus they cope with food and alcohol.
If there's different distribution of androgen receptors than normal men, why some bald men are hairy and some are not ? Why some bald men have muscles and some bald men are skinny ? I've seen men with rapid hair loss who supposedly should have high receptors and DHT sensitivity in their body, yet they're not that hairy at all, examples here on this forum are Fred. And here's me, i've been at Norwood 2 for 2-3 years now and i've only used treatments in one or less of those three years, so my hair loss is not aggressive, yet i'm a bit hairy and my beard started growing since 13.

I think the rest of the body has no relation with hair whatsoever. You can be hairy and not bald which means you're sensitive to DHT in your whole body, but not your head, and you can go bald extremely young and fast and still not be hairy or be able to grow a beard, because the rest of your body sensitivity is much lower than the sensitivity of your head.

I've also never seen a bald man with prostate cancer in my life and the only bald man i've seen with a heart disease is my father, and i know quite a lot of bald men.

I mean i know baldness suck and it makes people look bad, but we try our hardest to make it much more sucky and feel crappy about it instead of using treatments or transplants and live life normally.
You're a shit tier dumb poster - earth is flat etc. Reminds me of the clueless aunt, uncle John was good, the kids always loved him, this is a shock to us. -Wolf Nutsack, 2020

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Re: Hair loss and metabolic issues

Post by Afro_Vacancy » 8 months ago

Xexos wrote:
8 months ago
If there's different distribution of androgen receptors, why some bald men are hairy and some are not ? Why some bald men have muscles and some bald men are skinny ? I've seen men with rapid hair loss who supposedly should have high receptors and DHT sensitivity in their body, yet they're not that hairy at all, examples here on this forum are Fred. And here's me, i've been at Norwood 2 for 2-3 years now and i've only used treatments in one or less of those three years, so my hair loss is not aggressive, yet i'm a bit hairy and my beard started growing since 13.

I think the rest of the body has no relation with hair whatsoever. You can be hairy and not bald which means you're sensitive to DHT in your whole body, but not your head, and you can go bald extremely young and fast and still not be hairy or be able to grow a beard, because the rest of your body sensitivity is much lower than the sensitivity of your head.

I've also never seen a bald man with prostate cancer in my life and the only bald man i've seen with a heart disease is my father, and i know quite a lot of bald men.

I mean i know baldness suck and it makes people look bad, but we try our hardest to make it much more sucky and feel crappy about it instead of using treatments or a transplants and live life normally.
None of those things are single variable. Even baldness is multivariable -- we see men bald at different speeds, in different patterns, and have different responses including different side effects to two hair loss treatments that have different mechanisms.

Bald men are also more likely to develop heart disease and prostate cancer, that's measured. They also have lower serum levels of SHBG.

Aside from the fact that baldness is due to many separate genes, it's irrational to think that any one gene will only have one effect on the body. Nature is more efficient than that.
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I had a hair transplant operation with the clinic of Dr. Emrah Cinik in Istanbul, with 2750 grafts being mostly placed in the front. It was a success both for general aesthetics and general well-being, and I encourage others to do the same.

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Re: Hair loss and metabolic issues

Post by Xexos » 8 months ago

Afro_Vacancy wrote:
8 months ago
None of those things are single variable. Even baldness is multivariable -- we see men bald at different speeds, in different patterns, and have different responses including different side effects to two hair loss treatments that have different mechanisms.

Bald men are also more likely to develop heart disease and prostate cancer, that's measured. They also have power serum levels of SHBG.

Aside from the fact that baldness is due to many separate genes, it's irrational to think that any one gene will only have one effect on the body. Nature is more efficient than that.
That's the point, every bald man is different. Generalizing bald men because all of them lose hair on top of their head is psuedoscientific.

About SHBG, actually low levels are also dangerous since low SHBG levels increase the risks of obesity, insulin resistance, which occurs in type 2 diabetes, hypothyroidism, Cushing disease, nonalcoholic fatty liver disease, acromegaly (too much growth hormone in adults)
androgen steroid use, and actually most get treated for low SHBG since it's considered a bad thing. Also in the womb the human fetus has a low level of SHBG allowing increased activity of sex hormones. After birth, the SHBG level rises and remains at a high level throughout childhood.

Should i now say that fullheads, since they have lower levels of SHBG are more prone to those diseases than bald men ? Also while we're at it, tall height and large breasts increase the risk of cancer, does that mean they're a bad thing ?

The only reason baldness sucks because it's ugly, we don't have to do mental gymnastics to figure out why. The reason women, people and society despise bald men, not because we have "weak" gene, but because we look like shit and humans don't like things that look like shit including other humans.

And let's say we still have the same baldness gene with everything you said, but instead of having this
Image

We would end up like this
Image


Do you think society and women and people would treat us the same ? Do you think we would even care that much about hair or some of us even killing themselves because of it ?

That's why the idea of "natural selection" and survival of the fittest is horseshit, it's all about the halo effect, you can be the strongest, smartest "alpha" man with the "biggest chance of survival" out there, but if you look like shit women and people won't care about you and you can be the faggiest, stupidest twink guy ever known, but look good and women and people would still love you. That's humans, we love what that looks good. Whether they're other humans, animals, objects, trees or whatever. It doesn't require all those nonsense theories to explain something so obvious.

Also nature doesn't do shit, this world is intelligently designed by a creator.
You're a shit tier dumb poster - earth is flat etc. Reminds me of the clueless aunt, uncle John was good, the kids always loved him, this is a shock to us. -Wolf Nutsack, 2020

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Re: Hair loss and metabolic issues

Post by Afro_Vacancy » 8 months ago

Xexos wrote:
8 months ago
That's the point, every bald man is different. Generalizing bald men because all of them lose hair on top of their head is psuedoscientific.

About SHBG, actually low levels are also dangerous since low SHBG levels increase the risks of obesity, insulin resistance, which occurs in type 2 diabetes, hypothyroidism, Cushing disease, nonalcoholic fatty liver disease, acromegaly (too much growth hormone in adults)
androgen steroid use, and actually most get treated for low SHBG since it's considered a bad thing. Also in the womb the human fetus has a low level of SHBG allowing increased activity of sex hormones. After birth, the SHBG level rises and remains at a high level throughout childhood.

Should i now say that fullheads, since they have lower levels of SHBG are more prone to those diseases than bald men ? Also while we're at it, tall height and large breasts increase the risk of cancer, does that mean they're a bad thing ?

The only reason baldness sucks because it's ugly, we don't have to do mental gymnastics to figure out why. The reason women, people and society despise bald men, not because we have "weak" gene, but because we look like shit and humans don't like things that look like shit including other humans.

And let's say we still have the same baldness gene with everything you said, but instead of having this
Image

We would end up like this
Image


Do you think society and women and people would treat us the same ? Do you think we would even care that much about hair or some of us even killing themselves because of it ?

That's why the idea of "natural selection" and survival of the fittest is horseshit, it's all about the halo effect, you can be the strongest, smartest "alpha" man with the "biggest chance of survival" out there, but if you look like shit women and people won't care about you and you can be the faggiest, stupidest twink guy ever known, but look good and women and people would still love you. That's humans, we love what that looks good. Whether they're other humans, animals, objects, trees or whatever. It doesn't require all those nonsense theories to explain something so obvious.

Also nature doesn't do shit, this world is intelligently designed by a creator.
1) I can't see the pics.
2) There are multiple genes involved in baldness.
3) Many, possibly all, of those genes have multiple effects on the body.
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I had a hair transplant operation with the clinic of Dr. Emrah Cinik in Istanbul, with 2750 grafts being mostly placed in the front. It was a success both for general aesthetics and general well-being, and I encourage others to do the same.

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Re: Hair loss and metabolic issues

Post by EvilLocks » 8 months ago

actuallynotfromparis wrote:
8 months ago
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/a ... 360002763X

It has been my feeling for a long time that androgenetic alopecia happens to more and more people, men and women, at a much younger age. I am myself 24, and I feel like most of my male friends, and a good portions of my female friends have thinning hair.

At the same time, western societies have been consuming more and more and more sugar. We have been fighting fat like the plague, vegetarianism and veganism have resulted in many young people consuming less proteins and more sugars.

I'm gonna use that thread as a way to pin down everything I find about the link between the two.

(oh boy did i miss research - will add sources to everything over here later buy now i'm lazy and going to bed)
I honestly don't believe there is a correlation between diet and hair loss whatsoever, at least if we're talking about female/male pattern baldness or alopecia. If that were the case, why are there plenty of super healthy people with "perfect" diets that went bald? And, why are there plenty of fast food-abusing fat slobs with perfect heads of hair?
No, genetic hair loss is called GENETIC hair loss for a reason. It's an inherited sensitivity to hormones already present in the body. It has nothing to do with diet or lifestyle.
That said, I believe there could be a link between temporary shedding and diet or lifestyle, or hair loss due to deficiencies and such. The difference between these temporary forms of hair loss and genetic pattern baldness is, of course, that the temporary hair loss will resolve once the trigger is identified and treated accordingly.
Trust me, eating all the protein in the world will not bring our hair back if the culprit is genetic. A healthy and wholesome diet is good for our body of course, but it won't save our hair!

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Re: Hair loss and metabolic issues

Post by blackg » 8 months ago

I agree with EvilLocks, there is no correlation between diet and hair loss.
A mutherfuck I went to school with has eaten shit, drunk copious amounts of alcohol and taken his fair share of trips (psychedelic drugs) all while maintaining his high school hair line.

Fuck mother nature!
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Re: Hair loss and metabolic issues

Post by Pat » 8 months ago

There's a correlation between hairloss and diet. But it's the opposite of what people preach. Pizza and beer maxx to reduce your testosterone and thus DHT, and also increase your estrogen.
Image

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Re: Hair loss and metabolic issues

Post by Afro_Vacancy » 8 months ago

EvilLocks wrote:
8 months ago
I honestly don't believe there is a correlation between diet and hair loss whatsoever, at least if we're talking about female/male pattern baldness or alopecia. If that were the case, why are there plenty of super healthy people with "perfect" diets that went bald? And, why are there plenty of fast food-abusing fat slobs with perfect heads of hair?
No, genetic hair loss is called GENETIC hair loss for a reason. It's an inherited sensitivity to hormones already present in the body. It has nothing to do with diet or lifestyle.
That said, I believe there could be a link between temporary shedding and diet or lifestyle, or hair loss due to deficiencies and such. The difference between these temporary forms of hair loss and genetic pattern baldness is, of course, that the temporary hair loss will resolve once the trigger is identified and treated accordingly.
Trust me, eating all the protein in the world will not bring our hair back if the culprit is genetic. A healthy and wholesome diet is good for our body of course, but it won't save our hair!
Eating a ton of protein would actually be bad in this scenario, as protein inhibits autophagy.

Anyway, my actual opinion, there may be a lot of correlations, but the studies that I've seen have been quite poor. If there were a correlation, we would not know about it.

What has been demonstrated, in a study of TWINS, was that smoking accelerated hair loss. There were some other trends in there but i forget the details.
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Re: Hair loss and metabolic issues

Post by EvilLocks » 8 months ago

Afro_Vacancy wrote:
8 months ago
Eating a ton of protein would actually be bad in this scenario, as protein inhibits autophagy.

Anyway, my actual opinion, there may be a lot of correlations, but the studies that I've seen have been quite poor. If there were a correlation, we would not know about it.

What has been demonstrated, in a study of TWINS, was that smoking accelerated hair loss. There were some other trends in there but i forget the details.
When you say accelerating hair loss, do you mean hair shedding or actually speeding up baldness, as in the miniaturization process of the follicle?
While I could be open to the idea of diet and lifestyle impacting hair health in some way, my original point was that someone who's meant to go bald, will go bald regardless of what they eat or how they live.

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Re: Hair loss and metabolic issues

Post by Xexos » 8 months ago

blackg wrote:
8 months ago
A mutherfuck I went to school with has eaten shit, drunk copious amounts of alcohol and taken his fair share of trips (psychedelic drugs) all while maintaining his high school hair line.
You just don't understand it correctly.

Things like diet, fapping, or whatever, don't cause hair loss. Hair loss is genetics and will happen regardless. However, they can trigger hair loss earlier than expected or accelerates the process if you have the genetics to go bald. So having good diet and not masturbating might be beneficial for someone with the hair loss gene since it might save him some time, but he'll still go bald at the end and they won't have any effect on someone with no hair loss gene.
Last edited by Xexos 8 months ago, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Hair loss and metabolic issues

Post by Afro_Vacancy » 8 months ago

EvilLocks wrote:
8 months ago
When you say accelerating hair loss, do you mean hair shedding or actually speeding up baldness, as in the miniaturization process of the follicle?
While I could be open to the idea of diet and lifestyle impacting hair health in some way, my original point was that someone who's meant to go bald, will go bald regardless of what they eat or how they live.
It's been a while since I looked at the study. I can try and find it if you want.

But I think that what it means is that someone destined to go bald will go bald, but for a man, there is a big difference in reaching NW3 at age 25 and/or reaching at age 35. I think that's what it means. The second man in in a better position.
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I had a hair transplant operation with the clinic of Dr. Emrah Cinik in Istanbul, with 2750 grafts being mostly placed in the front. It was a success both for general aesthetics and general well-being, and I encourage others to do the same.

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