Intermittent and long-term fasting

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Re: Intermittent and long-term fasting

Post by Hairblues » Thu Oct 11, 2018 1:27 am

Lol

Okay I failed today will try again tomorrow

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Re: Intermittent and long-term fasting

Post by Afro_Vacancy » Thu Oct 11, 2018 5:41 pm

I plan on fasting next week -- hopefully I can pull it off lol. This week, I'm traveling in the American southwest and I like to eat out when travelling.

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Re: Intermittent and long-term fasting

Post by Afro_Vacancy » Thu Oct 11, 2018 5:53 pm

This is the actual case report from the article that @yettee linked:
http://casereports.bmj.com/content/2018 ... 4.full.pdf

It's by Dr. Jason Fung's group, he's a nephrologist at the University of Toronto medical system, I've previously linked to a lot of his articles and videos at hairlosstalk and I think even on this thread, here's Dr. Jason Fung's website:
https://www.idmprogram.com

They've had people fasting at their clinic for years, but so far they have not published much. Dr. Fung had said that the ethics board had made it challenging for him. It may be that this is why he's publishing this article -- it's about three modest fasters. They're doing 24-hour fasts. He's actually supervised a lot of 7-14-day fasts, those would be more interesting, but they may be harder to get published.

Interestingly, though these patients fasted and continued fasting for months, a lot of their benefits came early. Discontinuing insulin therapy took between 5 and 18 days of fasting, and these people had been dosing themselves with insulin for decades. That's impressive. It is almost guaranteed that they had previously tried and failed other lifestyle interventions.

This case report is written in standard rather than academic English. It can be read by most people.

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Re: Intermittent and long-term fasting

Post by Admin » Thu Oct 11, 2018 6:06 pm

Afro_Vacancy wrote:
Thu Oct 11, 2018 5:53 pm
Interestingly, though these patients fasted and continued fasting for months, a lot of their benefits came early. Discontinuing insulin therapy took between 5 and 18 days of fasting, and these people had been dosing themselves with insulin for decades. That's impressive. It is almost guaranteed that they had previously tried and failed other lifestyle interventions.
This is absolutely fascinating. If you had mentioned this to a "mainstream" physicians a few years ago, they'd have labelled you a crackpot.

Hell I'm sure you'll still get laughed at if you told them today. They'll most likely put it on the same levels as those shady internet natural cures.

Yet it's something that's been solid, and scientifically proven.

A low-carb diet will also help manage type 1 diabetes apparently:



I saw that Jordan Peterson was quite embarassed to talk about the miracles of his all-meat diet on Dr. Oz, he kept repeating "I'm no physician" which is wise, but still, it seems he struggled a lot to accept this as a reality because he initially dismissed people who were trying to cure their medical ailments with drastic diet changes.
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Re: Intermittent and long-term fasting

Post by Afro_Vacancy » Thu Oct 11, 2018 6:19 pm

Admin wrote:
Thu Oct 11, 2018 6:06 pm
This is absolutely fascinating. If you had mentioned this to a "mainstream" physicians a few years ago, they'd have labelled you a crackpot.

Hell I'm sure you'll still get laughed at if you do it today. They'll most likely put it on the same levels as those shady internet natural cures.

Yet it's something that's been solid, and scientifically proven.

A low-carb diet will also help manage type 1 diabetes apparently:

https://twitter.com/MikhailaAleksis/sta ... 9069971457

I saw that Jordan Peterson was quite embarassed to talk about the miracles of his all-meat diet on Dr. Oz, he kept repeating "I'm no physician" which is wise, but still, it seems he struggled a lot to accept this as a reality because he initially dismissed people who were trying to cure their medical ailments with drastic diet changes.
The fact that Peterson has the willpower for an all-meat diet is incredible. There are a few other people doing that right now, and I think that it's interesting. Perhaps I should try it for 14 days at one point to see what happens.

I suspect that what ails the Peterson family is different than what's being discussed above. I think that they have auto-immune conditions, whereas a lot of type -II diabetes (as discussed in the case report linked above) is due to insulin resistance. They might be related but I lean towards assuming that they are separate, independent, and complementary arguments for low-carb dieting.

There is also a third argument, which is that excess carbs might be bad for the brain, and a 4th, which is that fasting turns on autophagy which may help prevent cancer.

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Re: Intermittent and long-term fasting

Post by Admin » Thu Oct 11, 2018 6:32 pm

Afro_Vacancy wrote:
Thu Oct 11, 2018 6:19 pm
The fact that Peterson has the willpower for an all-meat diet is incredible. There are a few other people doing that right now, and I think that it's interesting. Perhaps I should try it for 14 days at one point to see what happens.

I suspect that what ails the Peterson family is different than what's being discussed above. I think that they have auto-immune conditions, whereas a lot of type -II diabetes (as discussed in the case report linked above) is due to insulin resistance. They might be related but I lean towards assuming that they are separate, independent, and complementary arguments for low-carb dieting.

There is also a third argument, which is that excess carbs might be bad for the brain, and a 4th, which is that fasting turns on autophagy which may help prevent cancer.
I eat the least amount of carbs possible, that's as far as I've gone with my diet. Today I ate a whole wheat multigrain sandwich and I hadn't felt this sluggish and bloated in a while, it lasted for a few hours.

We have a restaurant at work where I can get a steak and extra-meat for around 9€ with our discounts, so it's easy for me to keep up with my high-protein diet. I think I'm going to stick with that indefinitely now.

Back to this topic, fasting is something I've never seriously tried, I guess my biggest fear would be losing muscle. Other than that, I don't see how it could provide me with benefits that my high-protein diet don't already provide me.
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Re: Intermittent and long-term fasting

Post by koolaidshade » Thu Oct 11, 2018 6:40 pm

Low carb is such a scam. If you're gonna have carbs make sure they're refined and not whole grain, since whole grains can have anti nutrients such as phytates.

I'm currently on a variation of the vertical diet by stan efferding. Been getting more muscular and staying lean but working out less

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Re: Intermittent and long-term fasting

Post by Afro_Vacancy » Thu Oct 11, 2018 7:37 pm

koolaidshade wrote:
Thu Oct 11, 2018 6:40 pm
Low carb is such a scam. If you're gonna have carbs make sure they're refined and not whole grain, since whole grains can have anti nutrients such as phytates.

I'm currently on a variation of the vertical diet by stan efferding. Been getting more muscular and staying lean but working out less
Low-carb is not perfectly understood, but it's not a scam. It is clearly the case that many people with seemingly distinct conditions benefit from it.

We're discussing specific people in this thread. The first three are from a recently-published case study. Do you think that the doctor fabricated the charts?

The second is Jordan Peterson, do you think that he's lying?

Come on.

It's legitimate to say that low-carb may not be for everybody, and that there are some people involved who are scammers (e.g. the people selling bulletproof coffee, etc), but overall low-carb has some merit and should be further investigated.

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Re: Intermittent and long-term fasting

Post by koolaidshade » Thu Oct 11, 2018 8:58 pm

Right i may have been a little too reductionist in my last post.

I don't really like jordan peterson to be honest. didn't he get a hair transplant and lied about regrowing hair through his diet?

Anyhow i've been inspired to do intermittent fasting again and am on my 16th hour of not eating, its currently 1PM. i cant wait to get off work to hit the gym and go home and eat my rice/kale soup with steak and finish off with my no bake cheesecake

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Re: Intermittent and long-term fasting

Post by Admin » Thu Oct 11, 2018 9:37 pm

koolaidshade wrote:
Thu Oct 11, 2018 8:58 pm
I don't really like jordan peterson to be honest. didn't he get a hair transplant and lied about regrowing hair through his diet?
No, he just never mentioned his hair or his hair transplant.

I remember him (naively) saying that he got some alopecia because of his auto-immune disease.

Boy weren't we all wishing for some explanation along those lines at a point: "must be something else than genes!".

No, Peterson was a deep NW3 and got a hair transplant. I wish he would mention it at some point.

If said you were an antinatalist, so it doesn't surprise me that you don't like Jordan Peterson :p.
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Re: Intermittent and long-term fasting

Post by supremegentleman » Thu Oct 11, 2018 10:03 pm

I am currently on diet. I'll keep you updated on my results. It has only been one and half weeks so far. I started on the first of October. My starting weight was little above 80kg, currently 78.5 weighted myself today. Planning to go to 66 and if that works out then maybe little more.

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Re: Intermittent and long-term fasting

Post by koolaidshade » Thu Oct 11, 2018 10:07 pm

Admin wrote:
Thu Oct 11, 2018 9:37 pm
No, he just never mentioned his hair or his hair transplant.

I remember him (naively) saying that he got some alopecia because of his auto-immune disease.

Boy weren't we all wishing for some explanation along thos elines at a point: "must be something else than genes!".

No, Peterson was a deep NW3 and got a hair transplant. I wish he would mention it at some point.

If said you were an antinatalist, so it doesn't surprise me that you don't like Jordan Peterson :p.
I may be antinatalist but I still hold on to some traditional/conservative values, such as having a traditional household built (if a family with children was to be formed in the first place) from monogamy.

Also I try not to buy into many new age habits/treatments such as veganism and "grounding" etc

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Re: Intermittent and long-term fasting

Post by Afro_Vacancy » Fri Oct 12, 2018 5:06 pm

Am I better off not knowing what "grounding" is?

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Re: Intermittent and long-term fasting

Post by Admin » Fri Oct 12, 2018 5:14 pm

Afro_Vacancy wrote:
Fri Oct 12, 2018 5:06 pm
Am I better off not knowing what "grounding" is?
I think it's a good idea to keep an eye on what the crazies are doing. It's just about touching the 'earth' with your body. Hippie new age nonsense with 0 evidence to back it up.

Now it is a rabbit hole, and before you know it, this is where you end up:

https://www.vice.com/en_au/article/wdbg ... ld-save-it

:lol:
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Re: Intermittent and long-term fasting

Post by Afro_Vacancy » Fri Oct 12, 2018 8:49 pm

@Admin can you remind me how to link a tweet, like this:



Anyway, here's a nice, politically-incorrect result
https://now.tufts.edu/news-releases/mar ... 2-diabetes
Markers of dairy fat consumption linked to lower risk of type 2 diabetes

The more dairy fat you consume, on average, the less likely you to have type-II diabetes. Further, "This lower risk was independent of other major risk factors for type 2 diabetes including age, sex, race/ethnicity, socioeconomic status, physical activity and obesity."

My best guesses:
1) Milk, cheese, and yogurt are filling. If you eat more of them, you'll eat less of other things.
2) The bacteria in yogurt are just that wonderful.
3) The people who don't eat dairy fat end up consuming a lot of garbage such as vegetable shortening and almond milk.
Last edited by Admin on Fri Oct 12, 2018 8:57 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: Just make sure you add a line break before it, which is how I made it appear :)

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